Re: [TCML] Rotary Spark Gap Break Rate?

[bartb <bartb@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Christopher,
It doesn't matter if is ARSG or SRSG, it is still a function of gap 
charging between presentations. We've probably all run a wide spacing at 
one point or another on rotary gaps, but this is not something I would 
recommend to a list member because it is too easy to move past the 
threshhold of firing and component damage can occur (due to the 
recommendation especially someone not accustomed to rotary gaps).

Take care,
Bart



Christopher Karr wrote:
> Bart,
>
>  
>
> You have to remember that we're talking about an ARSG, which isn't made to fire at a certain break rate, but, rather, to simply quench well.
>
>  
>
> Christopher
>  
>   
> > Date: Thu, 16 Apr 2009 17:48:06 -0700
> > From: bartb@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > To: tesla@xxxxxxxxxx
> > Subject: Re: [TCML] Rotary Spark Gap Break Rate?
> > CC: 
> >
> > I'm happy Gary chimed in (I almost blew coffee out my nose). Just to add 
> > (regarding electrode spacing), an RSG is a "timing" gap. The time 
> > between presentations is what determines the cap voltage with the 
> > current charging the cap. Thus, spacing the electrodes wide is not 
> > helpful (but rather dangerous to your cap and transformer). The 
> > electrode spacing should be as narrow as is practical to ensure the gap 
> > fires at each presentation. If you want to lower bps and increase the 
> > voltage (in a controlled way), then reduce the rpm of the motor or 
> > remove some rotating electrodes or use a larger cap or increase the 
> > transformer current. There are a lot of ways to increase a larger bang 
> > size without spacing the electrodes wide. A mis-firing due to wide 
> > spacing can increase Vp by 2 or even higher on the next firing presentation.
> >
> > Take care,
> > Bart
> >
> > Lau, Gary wrote:
> >     
> > > As the question asked was specifically about break rate, the goal is not to spin as fast as possible. If it were, break rates of thousands BPS would easily be possible, but the power supply could never charge a reasonably sized cap fast enough.
> > >
> > > Rather, the goal is to supply a break rate that is appropriate for the cap size and charging capacity of the transformer, while ensuring that power arcing and poor quenching that would result if a static gap were used with a high-powered system, won't happen.
> > >
> > > I didn't follow "the electrodes need to be spaced so that they barely can break out at all when they're placed right in front of the stationary electrodes". In fact, the stationary and rotating electrodes should be spaced so the gap between them at alignment is as narrow as possible without risking a crash. Making the gap too wide risks missed firings at presentations.
> > >
> > > Also, using a static gap with a 60 Hz power supply by no means ensures that the resulting break rate is 60 or 120 BPS. By sizing the cap, transformer, and gap spacing, one might get an _average_ close to 120 BPS or any other number you choose, but the actual BPS will be chaotic and vary second-to-second. 
> > >
> > > Regards, Gary Lau
> > > MA, USA
> > >
> > >
> > >       
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: tesla-bounces@xxxxxxxxxx [mailto:tesla-bounces@xxxxxxxxxx] On
> > > > Behalf Of Christopher Karr
> > > > Sent: Thursday, April 16, 2009 12:06 PM
> > > > To: Tesla Pupman List
> > > > Subject: RE: [TCML] Rotary Spark Gap Break Rate?
> > > >
> > > > Andrew,
> > > >
> > > > The goal is to get the gap spinning as quickly as possible, and the electrodes need
> > > > to be spaced so that they barely can break out at all when they're placed right in
> > > > front of the stationary electrodes. The goal of the ARSG isn't to get a certain break
> > > > rate, but rather to get better air-flow by use of a motor and the same 120BPS or
> > > > 60BPS (on 60Hz) as with a stationary spark gap.
> > > >
> > > > Good luck,
> > > > Christopher
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >         
> > > > > Date: Thu, 16 Apr 2009 11:22:45 -0400
> > > > > From: teslamad@xxxxxxx
> > > > > To: tesla@xxxxxxxxxx
> > > > > CC:
> > > > > Subject: [TCML] Rotary Spark Gap Break Rate?
> > > > >
> > > > > What do you guys think the best break rate for an ARSG? I've heard 240 - 400
> > > > >
> > > > >           
> > > > bps
> > > >
> > > >         
> > > > > Currently, I'm designing a new gap with 10 rotary electrodes, 2 stationary
> > > > >
> > > > >           
> > > > electrodes, 1550 RPM motor, and if my math / formula is correct...
> > > >
> > > >         
> > > > > (1550rpm * 10 electrodes) / 60 = aprox. 258.33 bps
> > > > >
> > > > > What do ya think?
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Regards,
> > > > > Andrew
> > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Tesla mailing list
> > > > > Tesla@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > > http://www.pupman.com/mailman/listinfo/tesla
> > > > >
> > > > >           
> > > > _________________________________________________________________
> > > > Rediscover Hotmail(r): Get quick friend updates right in your inbox.
> > > > http://windowslive.com/RediscoverHotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Rediscove
> > > > r_Updates2_042009_______________________________________________
> > > > Tesla mailing list
> > > > Tesla@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > http://www.pupman.com/mailman/listinfo/tesla
> > > >
> > > >         
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Tesla mailing list
> > > Tesla@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > http://www.pupman.com/mailman/listinfo/tesla
> > >
> > >
> > >       
> > _______________________________________________
> > Tesla mailing list
> > Tesla@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > http://www.pupman.com/mailman/listinfo/tesla
> >     
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Windows Live™: Life without walls.
> http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_allup_1b_explore_042009_______________________________________________
> Tesla mailing list
> Tesla@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> http://www.pupman.com/mailman/listinfo/tesla
>
>   
_______________________________________________
Tesla mailing list
Tesla@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
http://www.pupman.com/mailman/listinfo/tesla