Re: Tesla coil Parts and plans

["Tesla list" <tesla@xxxxxxxxxx>]

Original poster: "Paul B. Brodie" <pbbrodie@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>

Gary,
Thank you and Dr. Resonance so much for your input and advice. I was 
beginning to think I wasn't going to get any comments at all. I suppose you 
guys get a little tired of answering the same old questions over and over 
again. Believe me, I have done considerable research on this, including 
reading volumes from the archives. Although most of my questions get 
answered this way, many times the information in the archive doesn't 
directly address my area of concern.

From what you have said, I plan to use the 2 Maxwell .03 mF caps in series 
for .015 mF. I had been leaning this way and I am greatly relieved that you 
concur. I feel sure that between being rated at 35 kv and advertized as 
designed for pulse discharge use, they should withstand the rigors of a 
SGTC of this size.

I will go ahead and start out with the 3 inch diameter toroid and get some 
4 inch or larger for later use. The stuff is inexpensive enough to 
experiment a little.

I have quite a bit of 4 inch PVC. I can easily build a taller secondary. I 
haven't wound it yet, just prepped the PVC. You said you would go 21" or 
longer. How much longer? I read a thread in the archives that suggested 
that 1500 turns is some kind of "sweet spot" for 4" to 6" coils. What is 
your opinion on this? I have over 3 lbs. of 26 AWG magnet wire so having 
enough wire isn't a problem.

I guess that pretty much sums things up for now. Thanks again and I'll let 
you know how it turns out.
Paul Brodie
Think positive
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tesla list" <<mailto:tesla@xxxxxxxxxx>tesla@xxxxxxxxxx>
To: <<mailto:tesla@xxxxxxxxxx>tesla@xxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 8:48 PM
Subject: RE: Tesla coil Parts and plans

> Original poster: "Lau, Gary" <<mailto:gary.lau@xxxxxx>gary.lau@xxxxxx>
>
> Hi Paul:
>
> Welcome to the List.  These are all good questions, and while they have
> been discussed in the past, there are no doubt others who would benefit
> from this, so I'm happy to reply on-line.  My comments interspersed:
>
> > Original poster: "Paul B. Brodie" 
<<mailto:pbbrodie@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>pbbrodie@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >
> > I have been scrounging parts to build a SGTC and so far I have: 15 kv
> 30 mA
> > NST, 3 lbs. of 26 AWG and 9 lbs. of 25 AWG magnet wire, a 8 ft x 4
> inch
> > piece of thin wall white PVC (not foam core), a 0 - 140 v 20 A variac,
> a
> > length of 3 inch diameter flexible dryer duct formed into a toroid
> with 2
> > pie plates forming the center, 50 ft. of .25 inch soft copper tubing,
> 50
> > .003 mF 35 kv film caps, two .03 mF 35 kv pulse discharge caps, 4 680
> pF 20
> > kv door knob caps, 2 .01 mF 40 kv poly caps, eight  5 kv 2 A diodes,
> an 8
> > ft copper clad ground rod, and a 4 series gap made with 1.5 inch hard
> > copper pipe inside a 5 inch piece of PVC with a cap that allows me to
> > connect the shop vac to the top and suck fresh air through the spark
> gap.
>
> Your .03/35kV caps sound like the Maxwell units sold on eBay, and they
> should be OK.  I couldn't comment on your .01/40kV or .003/35kV units
> without knowing a good deal more about them.  The doorknob caps are good
> for an R-C filter between the main gap and NST.  After things are tuned
> well, you may find that you can use something thicker than a 3x??
> toroid.
>
> > I also have Wintesla, Walt Noon's designer software, and JavaTC 9.1.
> They
> > all give very similar results, which is reassuring. I still have 1001
> > questions. My knowledge of electronics is virtually all self taught
> and I
> > worry that I am guilty of some misconceptions. Also, I am extremely
> > conservative and I want to build in as many protective features, both
> for
> > safety and protection of the coil itself.
> >
> > Before describing my plans for the controls, tank circuit, and
> primary, I'd
> > like to get the secondary out of the way. I have cut off 21 inch
> length of
> > 4 inch diameter PVC and sanded off all imperfections and ink. I then
> sealed
> > it with multiple coats of polyurethane, inside and out. The following
> may
> > have been a mistake. I covered all the area to be wound with wire with
> > double sided carpet tape to help hold the winds as I apply them. I
> want to
> > use the 26 AWG magnet wire and wind 18 inches. I have calculated that
> I can
> > get approximately 1000 winds. I also plan to seal both the top and
> bottom
> > of the secondary and provide a small hole in the bottom to equalize
> > pressure. I plan to leave 1 inch of PVC uncovered by wire at the
> bottom and
> > 2 inches at the top. How much space between the top of the secondary
> coil
> > and my toroid?
>
> The use of carpet tape is a new one and if it's clear, odds are that
> it's not a problem, but I still wouldn't bet the farm on it.  I
> personally would have put a few more turns, out to at least 21", but
> nothing is cast in stone here.  The lowermost extent of the toroid
> should generally be no more than 1-2 inches above the top turn.
>
> > Starting at the wall plug, I want to put an EMI filter between the
> wall
> > outlet and the variac. My first stupid question. My variac says that
> one
> > side is common to line and load. Does this mean that the variac is NOT
> > acting as an isolation transformer?
>
> Absolutely - it is not isolated.  You should look at the wiring; the
> neutral is common to input and output.
>
> > Do I ground the variac case to my house ground?
>
> Yes, and that's the only thing, with the possible exception of an EMI
> filter case, that goes go to house ground.
>
> > From the variac, I plan to go to the NST. Where do I ground the
> > NST, house ground or to the RF ground?
>
> RF ground, although some may differ.
>
> > From the NST, I want to wire to a
> > safety gap with the center grounded to my RF ground. Should I provide
> a
> > bypass cap between the NST and safety gap? Which caps are suitable for
> > this? Do I want to put in RF chokes between the safety gap and main
> > capacitor?
>
> Use an R-C filter.  Chokes used to be thought to be effective, but more
> recent research shows that they do more harm than good.  See my web site
> at 
<http://www.laushaus.com/tesla/protection.htm>http://www.laushaus.com/tesla/protection.htm 
for the filter circuit.
>
> > Any recommendations on which of the caps to use that I already
> > have? The software recommends approximately .006 mF cap for the
> primary.
> > The Java software recommends using a larger cap than is recommended by
> the
> > program. Here is where I think I am a little fuzzy.
>
> The software is computing the mains-resonant value - the value that
> would resonate at 60 Hz with your NST's secondary.  This was at one time
> thought to be the value that would extract the most power from the NST.
> This value will work, but it turns out that there's nothing magical or
> particularly sweet about it.  I've found that a value of 2 times the
> mains resonant value (when using static gaps) worked best for me.  I
> would try using your two .03uF caps in series for .015uF, or your .01uF
> cap, if it is in fact TC-worthy.
>
> > How is the value of the
> > primary cap determined? What is the impact of using a larger than
> necessary
> > cap? Does the size of the cap, the distance between gaps in the spark
> gap,
> > the inductance of the primary coil and the size of the toroid all
> impact
> > this calculation? Won't any of these factors change the resonant
> frequency?
>
> The cap size is generally chosen by sizing it according to the power
> supply - by choosing some multiple (1.5 to 2.0) of the mains-resonant
> value.  The secondary and top load sizes are also chosen based on the
> power supply size, although there is no simple or agreed upon formula
> here.  Mostly just experience and what "looks right".  Then the primary
> inductance is chosen to bring the primary and loaded secondary
> frequencies to the same value.  The main gap width is strictly a
> function of the power supply voltage, and has no bearing on frequency of
> anything.
>
> > Next, I want to wire to the series spark gap. How do I determine the
> width
> > of each individual gap? At what total gap should I start at? Will too
> wide
> > of a spark gap cause excessive load on the NST? I had trouble getting
> this
> > NST and I paid too much for it. I want to do everything I can, within
> > reason, to protect it!!!
>
> The ONLY way to set a static gap is to wire it across the NST at maximum
> variac, and set it to it just barely fire.  The caps must be out of the
> circuit for this adjustment.  For a ballpark figure you can use 0.25"
> total gap width for a 15kV power supply, but the exact figure will be a
> function of the gap geometry, airflow, air pressure, electrode
> temperature, texture, number of gap segments...   Many variables.  Too
> wide of a gap will permit excessive voltage on the caps and NST - FAR
> higher than the NST secondary rating - and this is why so many new
> builders fry their NST's.  Performance will always be much better with a
> wider gap, and it will be very short lived.
>
> > What type of wire should I be using to wire from the NST to the bypass
> cap
> > to the safety gap to the cap to the series SG and then to the primary
> coil?
> > I was planning to form the primary with a 6 inch diameter. One inch
> between
> > the inner winding and the base of the secondary coil. Is this
> sufficient
> > spacing? I plan to space .25 inch between windings. I calculate that I
> will
> > get between 13 and 15 windings. To attach to the primary, I plan to
> solder
> > my wire to an ATC fuse holder and then snap the fuse holder onto the
> copper
> > tubing wherever I like.
>
> The wiring from the NST to the safety gap to the main gap carries only a
> small current, so any size will do.  The loop consisting of the primary
> coil, main gap, and tank cap should be short, direct, and heavy.  For
> use with a 15/30 NST, probably anything 14gauge or heavier will do.
>
> > I am going to great lengths to build a substantial RF ground
> completely
> > separate from my electrical service and water pipes. The ground here
> is
> > very good for grounding, red clay with a high iron content. I plan to
> sink
> > at least 5 eight foot ground rods with 4 of them forming a square 5
> feet to
> > the side and cabled to each other and then cabled each to a central
> rod
> > which will be my attachment point for RF ground. This attachment point
> will
> > be approximately 10 feet from the TC location in the front of the
> garage. I
> > plan to use two 4 AWG car jumper cables, 4 strands total to attach the
> coil
> > to ground.
>
> Your ground will be far better than most ;-)
>
> > I plan to attach the NST case, the safety spark gap, and the base of
> the
> > secondary all to RF ground. Can someone please explain to me
> everything I
> > need to know and am afraid to ask about a counterpoise ground?
>
> With a ground that good I don't think you need a counterpoise.  I've
> never used one.
>
> > Any and all comments will be most gratefully accepted. If I seem to be
> > particularly off base in any area, please point it out. I am striving
> to
> > learn as much as I possibly can while doing this, instead of just
> following
> > someone's recipe. Oh yes, I almost forgot. I was contemplating using
> the HV
> > diodes I have to rectify the NST output to pulsed DC. Would this help
> to
> > ease the burden on the primary cap?
>
> I would skip the diodes.  The stress on the caps comes not from the 60
> Hz stuff, but from the tank frequency oscillations.
>
> > If anyone would like to communicate with me offline about this, please
> do.
> > My email is <mailto:pbbrodie@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>pbbrodie@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > Think positive!
>
> Regards, Gary Lau
> MA, USA
>
>