Re: Fun with Argon

["Tesla list" <tesla@xxxxxxxxxx>]

Original poster: Yurtle Turtle <yurtle_t@xxxxxxxxx>

I build and operate HUGE ozone generating facilities.
The three we most recently built three use Ozonia
generators:

http://www.ozonia.com/

These generate ozone using the "safe" method you
describe. We use pure Liquid Oxygen (LOX), so no NOx
is ever generated. When a leak develops in the
facility, depending on its severity, it can cause
severe respiratory irritation immediately. I've
breathed it and started wheezing within a matter of
seconds. And remember the reason we use it; for
disinfection. We use it because it is a far more
deadly disinfectant than chlorine gas. You mention
that you destroy rubber bands and kill mold, but fail
to acknowledge the possibility that ozone is harmful.
We disagree. However, you have an open invitation, if
you're even in the Atlanta, Georgia area, to come huff
10% pure ozone, manufactured from medical grade LOX in
a manner that you claim to be safe.

I suspect your "Ozone" air purifier is actually an air
ionizer. As to drinking ozone saturated water, I'd
like to know how you actually measured this. We also
saturate water with ozone, and use quite expensive
measuring equipment to monitor this. Without such
equipment, how can you claim to have reached
saturation? How do you measure the concentration and
purity of your ozone? Again, we use expensive
equipment. How do you get your low pressure ozone
dissolved into the water? We use stainless steel
venturi tubes to inject it into the water. After you
have done all this, you would have to drink it
incredibly fast, as the ozone is attacking all
contaminates in the water, and has an incredibly short
halflife.

And lets not forget groundlevel ozone, which is
generated by the sun's UV, not by sparks. I don't care
to argue with you, as you have made up your mind. I
just don't want you to cause some newbie to downplay
the potential dangers with playing with ozone.

Adam

--- Tesla list <tesla@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> Original poster: Gary Franklin
> <Franklin.Gary@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>
> Hi Matt,
>
> What an impressive list of references. But I base my
> opinion on my
> personal experience. I have an ozone air purifier in
> my residence that
> produces enough ozone to destroy a rubber band in a
> couple of days. I
> have been operating that machine continuously since
> 1997. Molds and odor
> don't last long in than environment. I have breathed
> ozone, drank water
> saturated with ozone, and injected it intravenously
> without harmful
> effects. So, you can probably tell that I don't have
> a lot of respect
> for experts' opinion.
>
> It seems that the problem is ozone that is generated
> with sparks. All
> the ozone I make with three different machine use
> high voltage cold
> corona discharge which means no sparks to generate
> the nitrogen oxides.
> Tesla got a patent for this method.
>
> Here is an article (c) 1986, written be another
> chemist who tried to
> kill a mouse with ozone and failed.
> http://www.oxygenmedicine.com/ozonetoxicity.html
>
> But the real question: Has anyone noticed any
> unusual effects from
> working with the inert gases?
>
> GF
>
>
> Tesla list wrote:
>  >
>  > Original poster: Mddeming@xxxxxxx
>  >
>  > In a message dated 12/4/04 3:56:54 PM Eastern
> Standard Time,
>  > tesla@xxxxxxxxxx writes:
>  > Original poster: Gary Franklin
>  >
>
<mailto:Franklin.Gary@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>Franklin.Gary@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>  >
>  > Tesla invented an ozone production method that
> produced only ozone, which
>  > is not toxic. The glass electrodes of a violet
> wand, also a Tesla
>  > invention I understand, produces ozone without
> the nitric compounds.
>  >
>  > GF
>  >
>  > Hi Gary,
>  >
>  >  From "Modern Chemistry" H.C.Metcalfe et. al.
> 1982:
>  > "Ozone is a poisonous, blue gas with an
> irritating and pungent odor."
>  > "The presence of ozone in amounts over 0.25 PPM
> ... can cause chest pain,
>  > coughing, headache, and eye irritation."
>  >
>  >  From Chemistry - A Study of Matter" A.B.Garrett
> et.al. 1972:
>  > "Even in 1 PPM concentration, ozone can cause
> bronchial irritation."
>  >
>  >  From "Essentials of General Chemistry" Hopkins
> and Bailar 1946:
>  > "In considering ozone for any such [deodorizing]
> use, however, it should be
>  > borne in mind that this gas is an active poison."
>  >
>  >  From "Handbook of Chemistry & Physics 77th ed."
> 1997:
>  > The threshold limit Value for Ozone is 0.1 PPM.
> This is ceiling value, not
>  > to be exceeded even for short periods.
>  >
>  >  From "Handbook of Chemistry and Physics 44th
> ed." 1960
>  > "Toxicity of Some Gasses and Vapors"
>  > Lists ozone as 1 PPM or 0.002 mg/l
>  >
>  >  From these, it would seem that the existence of
> non-toxic ozone is
> doubtful.
>  > If there is a "non-toxic" form of ozone, it was
> unknown to the general
>  > scientific community as recently as 1997. Of
> course, as one of my chemistry
>  > professors said, "If you have any doubts, stick
> your head under the vent
>  > hood and take several deep draughts."
>  >
>  > Matt D.
>
>
>