Re: Liability...the thread that will not die..

["Tesla list" <tesla-at-pupman-dot-com>]

Original poster: "Sundog by way of Terry Fritz <twftesla-at-qwest-dot-net>" <sundog-at-timeship-dot-net>

Hi All!
I hear the Moderator's Thead Cutters being sharpened here!.....*

You can prove anything with statistics, how many times have you heard "9 out
of 10 doctors prefer our painkillers!", but they never say in direct
comparison to what.  Sure, 9 out of 10 physicists prefer Smiley's headache
powder (baking soda and rat poison) to being beat unconcious with a length
of lead pipe in a dark alley......They're doctors, and they prefer baking
soda to get rid of a headache instead of that, so it's legitimate.  So I
trust statistics "as far as I can throw a fully loaded operating washing
machine" to quote someone I can't remember.

A good example :   I like my beer.  Heck, I *LOVE* my beer.  nothing beats a
bottle of ice-cold beer with some nuclear hot chicken wings. But I drink
responsibly. I don't drive even after 1 beer.  I get a ride.  I *know* it's
bad for me, and I take 100% responsibility for it.  I'm knowingly killing
myself one sip at a time, but it's *MY* choice, and i'm well aware of the
dangers.  In todays society, it wouldn't surprise me to see someone sue
their parents for premeditated murder by planning the pregnancy, with the
knowledge available that the child would eventually die. It's murder! :)

You all get the message.  Cover your butts well, expect the worst, and if
it's your fault, at least have the guts to admit it, be it stupid or
otherwise. We're all adults here, maybe immature (hey, that's me!), but
adults. Let's act like 'em.

For now, i'm going to dodge the moderators' Thread Cutters*

shad

* Yep.  Getting to be about that time ;-)  Terry

----- Original Message -----
From: Tesla list <tesla-at-pupman-dot-com>
To: <tesla-at-pupman-dot-com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2001 7:23 PM
Subject: Re: Liability...the thread that will not die..


> Original poster: "David Trimmell by way of Terry Fritz
<twftesla-at-qwest-dot-net>" <davidt-at-pond-dot-net>
>
> Juju statistics if I'v ever seen them! What is the simularity of a surgeon
> doing a tripple bypass and a 12 year old accidentally shooting his 4 year
> old brother? What did guns have to do with the liabilty issues of
> "expiremental" HV equipment?
>
> Like they say: apples and oranges
>
> Bottom line (IMHO): If you sell HV kits (disasembled TC) or other
> potentially dangerous equipment, just have the buyer sign a "end use
> statment" or a "hold harmeless" statement. I sign those all the time while
> purchasing chemicals...
>
> Something to the order:
>
> By agreeing to the perchase of "item", the buyer acknowledges:
>
> A. That he/she is 21 years of age or older,
> B. That there is no warrenty, expessed or implied, ie., item sold "as is"
> C. In no event shall the seller, or seller's heirs and assigns, be liable
> for consequential damages, nor shall seller's liability on any claim for
> damages arising out of or connected with the sale, delivery, or use of
> "Item"
> D. The buyer, or buyers successors and assigns, agrees to hold the seller
> harmless from and will indemnify seller from damages caused by the use of
> the "Item".
>
> Etc, etc....
>
> Regards,
>
> David Trimmell
>
> On Tue, 17 Jul 2001, Tesla list wrote:
>
> > Original poster: "Steve Rosenthal by way of Terry Fritz
> <twftesla-at-qwest-dot-net>" <sdrosen-at-cwia-dot-com>
> >
> > Subject: Guns & Doctors ??????
> >
> > Number of physicians in the US: 700,000.
> > Accidental deaths caused by physicians per year: 120,000.
> > Accidental deaths per physician.... 0.171
> > (U.S. Dept. of Health & Human Services)
> >
> > Number of gun owners in the US: 80,000,000
> > Number of accidental gun deaths per year (all age groups) 1,500.
> > Accidental deaths per gun owner: 0.0000188
> > Statistically, doctors are approximately 9,000 times more dangerous than
gun
> > owners. Not everyone has a gun, but everyone has at least one doctor.
Please
> > alert your friends to this alarming threat. We must ban doctors before
this
> > gets out of hand.
> >
> > I have withheld the statistics on lawyers for fear that the shock could
> > cause people to seek medical aid.
> >
> > ______________________________________________________________________
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Tesla list" <tesla-at-pupman-dot-com>
> > To: <tesla-at-pupman-dot-com>
> > Sent: Monday, July 16, 2001 9:41 PM
> > Subject: Liability...the thread that will not die..
> >
> >
> > > Original poster: "Jim Lux by way of Terry Fritz <twftesla-at-qwest-dot-net>"
> > <jimlux-at-earthlink-dot-net>
> > >
> > >
> > > Sure, lots of obviously dangerous things are sold, on E-bay, and
> > otherwise.
> > >  Consider, though, the difference:
> > >
> > > Roughly half the housholds in America have one or more guns (or, at
least,
> > > there are half as many guns as there are households... I don't recall
the
> > > basis of the statistic, but the net is, there's a lot)
> > >
> > > Every household has sharp kitchen knives
> > >
> > > A tiny, tiny, tiny fraction of the households has HV equipment of any
> > kind,
> > > lethal or not.
> > >
> > >
> > > Point #1:
> > >
> > > A "reasonable man" would be expected to know that knives, guns,
ladders,
> > > lawnmowers, power saws, etc. are dangerous.  It's not so clear that an
> > > average "reasonable man" would have the same level of knowledge about
a
> > > tesla coil.
> > >
> > > Point #2:
> > >
> > > The huge number of folks possessing kitchen knives and various and
sundry
> > > firearms means that not only are most folks familiar with them, their
> > > hazards, and their use, but that the probability of them being
outlawed or
> > > restricted excessively is quite low. This is definitely not the case
for
> > HV
> > > equipment.  No congressman or senator or assemblyman or city council
> > > member, etc. is going to worry about the re-election impact of banning
> > > tesla coils.  They would have to be insane to contemplate banning or
> > > restricting kitchen knives.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > > forgive my nievety of the law, but do gun manufacturors get sued
when
> > > > > someone is inadvertantly shot?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>