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# Re: Sphere/Toroid Comparison Chart

```Original poster: "Luc by way of Terry Fritz <twftesla-at-uswest-dot-net>" <ludev-at-videotron.ca>

Hi guy

I post again the same question: If you look at the chart you'll
see that until you hit 18" of exterior diameter the toroid with a
thickness of 4" have more capacity than one of 6" thickness.
Please could some of you explain to me how a toroid with an area
bigger could have a smaller capacity. I already know that the
surface facing the center ( the hole of the donut ) don't
participated as far as the exterior. But the exterior of a 6"
thick toroid is bigger than the area of a 4" one.

Tx

Luc Benard

Tesla list wrote:
>
> Original poster: "Kurt Schraner by way of Terry Fritz
<twftesla-at-uswest-dot-net>" <k.schraner-at-datacomm.ch>
>
> John C., Matt D., Terry-
>
> John, your posting has made me to take another look at the table, Matt
> D. has posted Thursday, May 03, 2001. I need to point to two facts, in
> case, somebody likes to make use of this table. In any case, however,
> beeing it a toroid or a sphere in TC use, I would rather prefer, to make
> the E-Tesla6 calculation. The 2 facts are:
>
> 1.) Error here, in definition of diameter: NOT center-center, but
> outer (maximal) diameter of toroid!!! (plausibility: Bert P.'s Eqn.)
>    |
>    V
> > C-C        Chord Nom.
> > Toroid     Toroid     Cap       Equiv.Diam. Equiv.Diam.
> > d1(inches) d2(inches) pf       sphere (in.)  sphere (m)
> >
> > 8          4.00     7.723          5.47      0.1390
> > 8          6.00     4.540          3.22      0.0817 not feasible
> > 10         4.00     10.675         7.56      0.1921
> > 10         6.00     8.243          5.84      0.1484 not feasible
> > 12         4.00     13.262         9.40      0.2387
> > 12         6.00     11.585         8.21      0.2085
> > 14         4.00     15.574         11.04     0.2803
> > 14         6.00     14.605         10.35     0.2629
> > 16         4.00     17.675         12.53     0.3181
> > 16         6.00     17.359         12.30     0.3125
> > 18         4.00     19.607         13.89     0.3529
> > 18         6.00     19.893         14.10     0.3581
> > 20         4.00     21.402         15.17     0.3852
> > 20         6.00     22.245         15.76     0.4004
> > 22         4.00     23.083         16.36     0.4155
> > 22         6.00     24.444         17.32     0.4400
> > 24         4.00     24.668         17.48     0.4440
> > 24         6.00     26.512         18.79     0.4772
> > 26         4.00     26.170         18.55     0.4711
> > 26         6.00     28.469         20.18     0.5124
> > 28         4.00     27.601         19.56     0.4968
> > 28         6.00     30.329         21.49     0.5459
> > 30         4.00     28.969         20.53     0.5214
> > 30         6.00     32.103         22.75     0.5779
>
> 2.) John, I was not able to find a satisfactory way, using the equations
> I find on your website, to represent the above table (trying quite a
> number of some possible input data errors about C-C vs. outer d1).
>
> Cheers
>        Kurt Schraner
>
> Tesla list wrote:
> >
> > Original poster: "John H. Couture by way of Terry Fritz
> <twftesla-at-uswest-dot-net>" <couturejh-at-worldnet.att-dot-net>
> >
> > The overlap is not a problem with the Toroid Capacitance Graph I show
in the
> > Tesla Coil Notebook because I did not use Bert Pool's equation. The
> > equations I used are shown on my web site. Look for  Secondary Terminal at
> >
> > http://home.att-dot-net/~couturejh/
> >
> > John Couture
> >
> > -----------------------------
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Tesla list [mailto:tesla-at-pupman-dot-com]
> > Sent: Sunday, May 06, 2001 9:04 AM
> > To: tesla-at-pupman-dot-com
> > Subject: Re: Sphere/Toroid Comparison Chart
> >
> > Original poster: "by way of Terry Fritz <twftesla-at-uswest-dot-net>"
> > <Mddeming-at-aol-dot-com>
> >
> > In a message dated 5/5/01 2:52:15 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
tesla-at-pupman-dot-com
> > writes:
> >
> > >
> > > Original poster: "Barton B. Anderson by way of Terry Fritz <
> > > twftesla-at-uswest-dot-net>" <tesla123-at-pacbell-dot-net>
> > >
> > > Hi Matt,
> > >
> > > The toroid C value is obviously calc'd in these (standard toroid
> > > equations) as well
> > > as the spheres. But there is a problem with some. Toroid cord and
> > > diameters overlap
> > > on some which is impossible and the equation is then wrong for those
> > > toroids (and
> > > also wrong for the equiv. spheres). For example, the 8" x 6" toroid. The
> > > cord is 6",
> > > and therefore the outer diameter must be larger than 12". This is why the
> > > capacitance
> > > is way off on these particular impossible toroids.
> > >
> > > Take care,
> > > Bart A.
> >
> > Hi Bart!
> > Thanks for pointing out the impossibilities. The table was generated for a
> > range of sizes, and since I was not trying to build an impossible size, I
> > guess I overlooked the silliness at the lower (upper) end of the chart.
> > Since some people are talking about metallic "garden spheres" in lieu of
> > toroids, I thought a quick comparison might help.
> > With egg on face,
> > Matt D.

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