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Re: True Toroid Capacitance
Original poster: Bart Anderson <classi6-at-classictesla-dot-com>
Hi John,
Yes, the disc. It does change Fres, but only slightly in this case. I input
the disk into Javatc as the program is designed for such aspects. I should
note that not every coil will hit Fres as close as the demo coil. There is
a margin of error and just like any program. I could easily have input a
different coil and found it to be off by a small percent. The fun of course
is tracking down where a large error exist. Most of the time when this
occurs, I've found my own measurements to be not quite perfect. Once I fine
tune my measurements (clean my glasses), the error drops well within the
programs expectations.
Take care,
Bart
Tesla list wrote:
>Original poster: "John H. Couture" <couturejh-at-mgte-dot-com>
>
>Bart -
>
>Your JAVATC10 program is living proof that TC programs can be made to work
>in spite of the fact that engineering texts say that Tesla coil design is
>only empirical. The same is true for the E-Tesla6 program. If I had entered
>the inputs correctly I would have obtained a much closer resonant frequency
>to the actual test frequency instead of what I found.
>
> I checked your inputs shown below with my inputs and found that I had used
>an input for the disk which gave a total secondary capacity that was too
>high and resonant frequency too low. I agree that this disk should have been
>left out of the inputs because it obviously does not affect the resonant
>frequency according to the actual test results. I do have an old version
>V6.11C of the program that I will replace with the V6.13C.
>
>I believe you, Terry, and Paul have done a great job in putting together
>some very complex TC programs. I am happy that the JAVATC and E-Tesla
>programs are working so well together. Thank you for sending me the E-Tesla
>inputs to check and correct my inputs.
>
>John Couture
>
>-----------------------
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Tesla list [mailto:tesla-at-pupman-dot-com]
>Sent: Thursday, November 06, 2003 9:59 AM
>To: tesla-at-pupman-dot-com
>Subject: Re: True Toroid Capacitance
>
>
>Original poster: Bart Anderson <classi6-at-classictesla-dot-com>
>
>Hi John,
>
> >However, this was at 229.58 KHz and not at the measured frequency of 238.25
> >KHz. I do not know why E-Tesla6 shows a different resonant frequency with
> >the same toroid and Sec inductance of 18.78 mh because the surrounding
> >conditions are the same.
> >
> >This new TC research needs to be verified with additional testing and all
> >comments are welcomed.
>
>
>I just ran E-Tesla6 with your 18.78mH input:
>C=23.29pF F=240.65 kHz
>
>Pretty close to Javatc and well within the margin of error against measured
>to programs values for both programs. Is it possible you may be using the
>old version 6.12? The current version is 6.13C. To check it, I've
>copy/paste the output.txt file from my run with E-Tesla6 for reference. If
>you see an input disagreement, that may also explain your numbers.
>
>Take care,
>Bart
>
>-----------------------------------------------------
>E-TESLA V6.13C July 26, 2003
>Grid Size = 200.000000
>Scale Multiplier = 1.000000
>Terminated Coil
>Ceiling Distance = 150.000000
>Wall Distance = 103.000000
>Primary Height (Inner Turn) = 13.835000
>Primary Inner Diameter = 5.970000
>Primary Outer Diameter = 13.950000
>Primary Height (Outer Turn) = 13.835000
>Strike Rail Height = 0.000000
>Strike Rail Diameter = 0.000000
>Secondary Base Height = 13.835000
>Secondary Diameter = 4.538500
>Secondary Length = 20.165001
>Secondary Turns = 900.000000
>Secondary Wire AWG Size = 24.000000
>Secondary Inductance (mH) = 18.780001
>Terminal-1 Height (center) = 36.500000
>Terminal-1 Cord Diameter = 4.500000
>Terminal-1 C-C Diameter (toroid only)= 14.750000
>Terminal-2 Height (center) = 36.500000
>Terminal-2 Cord Diameter = 0.000000
>Terminal-2 C-C Diameter (toroid only)= 0.000000
>Top Voltage = 100.000000
>Pass Ccalc (pF) Change Fcalc (Hz)
> 1000 C=16.47939 Err%=1647839.375000 F=286089.34
> 2000 C=20.13227 Err%=22.166338 F=258836.73
> 3000 C=21.50607 Err%=6.823863 F=250433.13
> 4000 C=22.16243 Err%=3.051977 F=246696.86
> 5000 C=22.52905 Err%=1.654248 F=244681.34
> 6000 C=22.75677 Err%=1.010779 F=243454.05
> 7000 C=22.90824 Err%=0.665608 F=242647.84
> 8000 C=23.01330 Err%=0.458590 F=242093.36
> 9000 C=23.08799 Err%=0.324553 F=241701.45
>10000 C=23.14191 Err%=0.233543 F=241419.72
>11000 C=23.18114 Err%=0.169545 F=241215.31
>12000 C=23.20989 Err%=0.123984 F=241065.92
>13000 C=23.23097 Err%=0.090832 F=240956.52
>14000 C=23.24648 Err%=0.066787 F=240876.09
>15000 C=23.25791 Err%=0.049147 F=240816.92
>16000 C=23.26634 Err%=0.036256 F=240773.28
>17000 C=23.27256 Err%=0.026715 F=240741.13
>18000 C=23.27715 Err%=0.019760 F=240717.34
>19000 C=23.28053 Err%=0.014517 F=240699.88
>20000 C=23.28305 Err%=0.010790 F=240686.89
>21000 C=23.28485 Err%=0.007749 F=240677.56
>22000 C=23.28618 Err%=0.005692 F=240670.70
>23000 C=23.28714 Err%=0.004142 F=240665.73
>24000 C=23.28785 Err%=0.003054 F=240662.05
>25000 C=23.28840 Err%=0.002354 F=240659.22
>26000 C=23.28870 Err%=0.001304 F=240657.66
>27000 C=23.28901 Err%=0.001304 F=240656.08
>28000 C=23.28917 Err%=0.000685 F=240655.25
>29000 C=23.28927 Err%=0.000439 F=240654.73
>30000 C=23.28932 Err%=0.000238 F=240654.44
>31000 C=23.28935 Err%=0.000112 F=240654.31
>32000 C=23.28937 Err%=0.000097 F=240654.19
>
>
>
>