Re: [TCML] Stacking vs Large Diameter

["Phillip Slawinski" <pslawinski@xxxxxxxxx>]

Bart,

Thanks for that.  I had been playing around in JavaTC as well.  It did cross
my mind to compare stacking the toroids one on top of the other, and then
with some separation, but I never got around to it.  The laptop I run it on
is a piece of garbage.

One thing I should note is that when I was running calculations when I had
my 23x7 and 21x6 stacked on top of each other the calculations took an
excruciatingly long time.  Granted, my laptop is a piece of garbage, but
we're talking about 20 times as long as opposed to a single toroid.  [300sec
vs 18]

By the way, thanks for writing this tool.  I too code in JavaScript and I
know what a humongous pain it is to get it to work correctly in several
browsers.  What you've done with JavaTC is no small feat.

On Mon, Jul 14, 2008 at 11:54 PM, bartb <bartb@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> I believe Ed Sonderman put the cylinder between the toroids to add a little
> contribution to capacitance. However, I've never looked at that aspect since
> Javatc had the capability to decipher it. Ok, well, I took a whole 30
> seconds of my life and looked at it.
>
> I used the default coil in Javatc (default toroid dimensions are 6.25" x
> 21").
> Ctoroid = 23.286pF
>
> I then inserted a second toroid 14 inches above the original (same toroid
> geometry): A dual stack with 14" separation center to center.
> Ctoroid = 34.397 pF
>
> I then inserted a cylinder with a diameter equal to the outer radius of the
> toroids with top and bottom cylinder ends at each toroids center line.
> Ctoroid = 36.072 pF ( Yipes! Not a big change, is it?).
>
> Well, capacitive contribution of the cylinder is minimal. I doubt it made a
> big difference after that analysis. The coil probably would have done just
> as well with out it.
> For what it's worth, lets look at the top toroid simply sitting on the
> bottom of the first toroid:
> Ctoroid = 29.183pF (big difference from the 34.397 pF due to the 14"
> separation).
>
> Clearly, the toroid at 14" above hit nearly 34.5pF. Ok, good for identical
> toroids stacked with a decent distance apart.
> Let us look at  a single "larger" toroid, and I'll only increase it by 25%
> in both minor and major diameters (7.8125" x 26.25").
> Ctoroid = 31.051 pF (Nice increase for only a single toroid).
>
> Now, I increase the original by only 50% (9.375" x 31.5"): Oh yea, that
> toroid rocks!
> Ctoroid = 39.325 pF
>
> Certainly beat out the dual stack. Only 50% increase with a single toroid
> and I've certainly beaten the dual stack even at 14" separation! So, why the
> need for dual, triple, etc.? No real need, more convenience and mechanical
> in nature. If you have them on hand, use them. If you just happen to have a
> nice 10" x 32" toroid lying around, then use it!
>
> Take care,
> Bart
>
>
>
>
>
> Phillip Slawinski wrote:
>
>> On Mon, Jul 14, 2008 at 9:56 PM, bartb <bartb@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> Looks perfectly acceptable to me! I like the distance you have between
>>> toroids. Ed Sonderman did similar except to have put a sheet metal type
>>> cylinder between the two toroids.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> Was this for support, or otherwise?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> He did get some long sparks on this dual-stack toroid.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> Your base looks really nice also. I like those red colored standoffs!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Thanks, it's taken a lot of work to get my coil where it is now.  I've
>> only
>> been building coils since the beginning of May, I think I've made a lot of
>> progress in the short time.  I scored the standoffs for free!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> Take care,
>>> Bart
>>>
>>>
>>>
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