[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next][Date Index][Thread Index]
RE: [TCML] Best bottle cap electrolytes, was re:HV capacitors wanted
Hi Gary,
I was under the impression that plain water (de-ionized or distilled0 is a
pretty good dielectric. If it is the results of minerals, how could this be
repeated anywhere else?
Jim Mora
-----Original Message-----
From: tesla-bounces@xxxxxxxxxx [mailto:tesla-bounces@xxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
Of Lau, Gary
Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2008 6:35 AM
To: Tesla Coil Mailing List
Subject: RE: [TCML] Best bottle cap electrolytes, was re:HV capacitors
wanted
While studies have been made comparing the conductivities of various
electrolytes, it may be worthwhile to compare actual spark performance of
electrolytes. Someone recently mentioned to me off-list that his experience
was that plain water appeared to work as well as brine. I have no further
information about this; I can't comment on the purity of the plain water or
the accuracy and test conditions of the comparison.
Who knows, it may just be a hasty observation, or it may be that electrolyte
losses at RF frequencies don't correlate to DC measurements. Or that all
such losses pale in comparison to gap losses. It _would_ be nice to use
just pure, non-corrosive water.
Regards, Gary Lau
MA, USA
> -----Original Message-----
> From: tesla-bounces@xxxxxxxxxx [mailto:tesla-bounces@xxxxxxxxxx] On
> Behalf Of FIFTYGUY@xxxxxxx
> Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2008 4:32 AM
> To: tesla@xxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [TCML] Best bottle cap electrolytes, was re:HV capacitors wanted
>
>
>
> In a message dated 12/2/08 9:43:03 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
> pslawinski@xxxxxxxxx writes:
>
> >If you're stuck with glass bottle capacitors, you should try baking soda
and
> >water instead of salt and water. Supposedly baking soda is more
>
> >conductive.
>
>
> I found that hard to believe (I work for a company that manufactures
> electrolytic cells for on-site generation of chlorine gas from table
salt). A
> saturated NaCl solution has a conductivity of around 0.25 S/cm.
> I've also used the electrolytic process for rust removal, and it's
> generally agreed that sodium bicarbonate is one for the slowest-working
> electrolytes for that application. Sodium Carbonate (baking powder) works
more
> quickly.
> Here's a science fair project where various salts were evaluated for
> conductivity specifically for Tesla coil bottle capacitor applications:
>
> :http://www.usc.edu/CSSF/History/2005/Projects/J0535.pdf
>
> BTW, Sodium Hydroxide would have 50% better conductivity than NaCl,
but
> it has a decreasing conductivity once you get over 20 percent
concentration.
> The conductivity of various salt solutions can be highly dependent on
> temperature, are typically non-linear, and as in the case of NaOH, can
have a
> local maximum with regards to concentration.
> Hydrochloric Acid (HCl) at the 37% azeotrope would have three times
the
> conductivity of saturated NaCl.
>
> It would be interesting to see if the conductivity of the electrolyte
in
> the bottle caps made any noticeable difference. After all, they represent
a
> pretty big surface area, and the spark gap has a dynamic impedance in the
> neighborhood of a few Ohms. Using more bottles that were smaller could
have
> just as large an effect as using a different electrolyte, and the would
also
> theoretically improve the AC impedance of the cap bank as well. Probably
also
> help mitigate heating of the glass in the caps as well.
>
> -Phil LaBudde
_______________________________________________
Tesla mailing list
Tesla@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
http://www.pupman.com/mailman/listinfo/tesla
_______________________________________________
Tesla mailing list
Tesla@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
http://www.pupman.com/mailman/listinfo/tesla