Re: Terry's Test - Two Manifestations of Charge

["Tesla list" <tesla@xxxxxxxxxx>]

Original poster: "Mark Broker" <mbroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>

On Wed, 06 Jul 2005 02:11:16 -0500, Tesla list <tesla@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> Original poster: "David Thomson" <dwt@xxxxxxxxxxxx>

>  >From the black body page: "So, as temperature increases, the glow
> color changes from red to yellow to white to blue."
>
> Does this mean the thin purple spark is hotter than the thick
> white spark?

The spark is "redder," ergo cooler.  But I pretty much agree with Jim (see 
his responses).


> How do you think the potential from the tube to ground will
> compare to the potential between the topload and tube, given the
> tube is exactly in between?  Would you predict that by changing
> the angle of the tube with respect to the coil that the physical
> appearance of the sparks will change?

I expect the tube will have more than half the potential of the topload 
when placed in the middle as shown by you and Terry.  Adjusting the angle 
of the tube/rod I expect would make the sparks more even in appearance as 
the coupling between the TC and the conductive rod decreases.

I'd love to be able to test this in Etesla, just for grins, but it uses 
cylindrical symmetry and cannot simulate a conductive rod next to the coil 
as in these experiments.  A 3D version of ETesla was on my TODO list about 
4 years ago, but it quickly fell off the list because it required too much 
effort and computer horsepower for too little gain.


>  > Didn't Michelson and Morley disprove the aether theory pretty
>  > thoroughly?
>  > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michelson-Morley_experiment
>
> Actually, no.  They proved that there is an Aether drift of ten
> thousand kilometers per second.  This was verified in over
> 100,000 repetitions of the experiment over 20 years and
> culminated with Dayton Miller's work.

Niels Bohr decided that the sheer number of "null results" is indicative of 
disproving the theory, which, right or wrong, apparently has resulted in 
people apotheosizing (your word of the day :) ) his remark.

Perhaps it would be best to call "the aether" something else - dark energy, 
or perhaps the Higgs Field - "aether" seems to conjure too much acrimony 
these days.


> Also, in 1966, Dieter Brill and Jeffrey Cohen changed the name
> from "Aether drift" to "frame dragging," and using a satellite,
> proved that it does exist.

AFAIK frame dragging hasn't been "proven" yet, despite the evidenciary 
support from the two LAGEOS satellites.

Reading up on stuff like this the primary reason why my TODO list never 
seems to get any shorter. :p


>  > >It is interesting to me that it can be proven, at least
> visually
>  > >so far, that there are indeed two distinct manifestations of
>  > >charge, which matches the quantities derived from the
> empirical
>  > >data.
>  >
>  > All that we have proven, visually speaking, is that one spark
> has more
>  > current than the other.
>
> I must have missed something.

You said, "It is interesting to me that it can be proven, at least visually 
so far, that there are indeed two distinct manifestations of charge...."

No, these experiments do not "prove" that, which is what I stated 
earlier.  Nor was there "absolute proof" that one spark has more current 
than the other: I mispoke earlier when I used the "P word."  What I meant 
to say is that one spark appears to be carrying more current than the 
other, a statement which is based off decades of research on spark discharges.


We also know
> that the vacuum tube will produce this result and that a mere
> piece of metal between the topload and ground will not.
>
> I understand that there are some theories and opinions as to what
> the observations mean, but as far as I understand it, nothing has
> been done to prove anything, yet.


Now we know that the brighter spark carries more current and a metal pipe 
has the same effect as the flourescent tube, thanks to Terry.


I think that the topics of aether/frame dragging/dark energy/etc are so far 
off the topic of Tesla Coils that further onlist discussion should be 
altogether discontinued....

Cheers!

Mark Broker
The Geek Group