Re: Secondary Theory (Was Bipolar Coil)-Heretical view

To: tesla-at-pupman-dot-com
Subject: Re: Secondary Theory (Was Bipolar Coil)-Heretical view
From: Terry Fritz <twftesla-at-uswest-dot-net>
Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 17:49:01 -0600
Approved: twftesla-at-uswest-dot-net
Delivered-To: fixup-tesla-at-pupman-dot-com-at-fixme
In-Reply-To: <3743743D.5085-at-pacbell-dot-net>
References: <4.1.19990517041149.00a5b2b0-at-pop.dnvr.uswest-dot-net> <4.1.19990518114356.00a30510-at-pop.dnvr.uswest-dot-net>

Hi Ed,

The Q of the primary is 28.846
The Q of the Secondary with the streamer load is 11.78.
The Q of the secondary without the load is 165.78. 

Of course, these Q values are for a steady state sine driven system.  I
wonder if they are valid in an impulse driven system which is how our coils
really work???

These are calculated numbers but I have measured the Q of the secondary
(with no load) at 165 using a signal generator too.  I could probably
measure the Q of the primary too with a signal source (Nope! The spark gap
needs to be in there too!!!).  However, the above numbers were calculated
using parameters of the coil determined from measurements while it was running.

The primary is a series LCR configuration with the voltage measured across
the primary coil.  the values are:

Rp = 3 ohms
Cp = 17.05 nF
Lp = 127.9 uH

The secondary system is third order with the following parameters:

Rs = 69 (DC) + 250 (ac) ohms
Ls = 75.4 mH
Cself = 16.68 pF
Cterm = 10.25 pF
Rload = 220000 ohms
Cload = 5 pF

I calculated the Qs using MicroSim and a voltage source since it is really
easy to do that way (especially when the order is above two :-))

Soooooo..  The secondary system Q starts at 165 and drops to 12 with the
streamers.  I have screen captures of the schematic and frequency sweep
charts if you or anyone else wants to see them.  Write me a note at
terrellf-at-uswest-dot-net and I'll send the 170K zip file to those that want the
details.  I'll forward them to Ed right now.  Hopefully, I will get my
website cleaned up soon so I can just post such stuff...

Cheers,

	Terry

At 07:32 PM 5/19/99 -0700, you wrote:
>Terry:
>
>	Read your notes on arc impedance with lots of interest.  The relative
>insensitivity of the discharge impedance to the power in it is
>surprising (but maybe not to someone who really knows the physics of
>atmosphric-pressure discharges).  The streamer lengths certainly tend to
>increase with duration of the discharge (significant fractions of a
>second), and can be "blown out" with an air blast (at least for the
>small coils I have played with), so I assume your equivalent circuit
>applies with a fully-developed set of streamers.  If I didn't slip a
>decimal point, looks as if the Q of a secondary with fully-developed
>streamers if of the order of 20 or so, compared to several hundred at
>power "before breakout".  Am I correct?
>
>Ed
>

References:

Re: Secondary Theory (Was Bipolar Coil)-Heretical view

From: Terry Fritz <twftesla-at-uswest-dot-net>