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Re: Tesla's Energy Transmission (Warning: Another Long Post)



Hi Mike,
            nice to see I'm not alone :-) My comments:

<< Hi all,
 Just thought I'd throw in a few comments about this.  Food for thought as it 
 were.
 >  
 >  The Springs system worked at "about" 40kW.  "Similar" power distribution
 >  ground systems "I" have worked with can "sink" (gulp) 250 Megawatts with
 >  ground effects at 100 yards away being zilch.  Yep, that's here in dry
 >  sandy Colorado too...  I think the "ground" can sink one "heck of a lot of
 >  juice".
 >  
 But this was NOT using longitunal waves as Tesla said he was generating.
Exactly
 >  
 >  100 MegaJoules????  If I remember right, he used about say 30kV at 60 Hz.
 >  That would give a cap value of 1.85mF.  Tesla's salt water caps fell far
 >  short of that...  The 1899 Colorado Springs power plant was not in the 100
 >  megawatt class...
 >  
 I seem to remember reading that he used a 60kV Westinghouse transformer.  
 That would increase the energy by a factor of 4 from what state above in 
that 
 respect alone.   Also, didn't he use a rotary gap that would deliver a 
firing 
 rate MUCH higher than 60Hz?  This would allow the use of a smaller cap and 
 much more power throughput.  I thought he used toothed wheels that allow for 
 break rates well over a thousand BPS. 
I think the actual drive set up is irrelevant - the recorded terminal 
voltages tell us all we need to know. 
 >  
 >  Where is "it written" that Tesla got a 120 foot spark, and where "on Earth
 >  in 1899" did he find a Giga Joule????
 >  
 I thought the 120 foot sparks were indeed achieved once - just before he 
blew 
 out the Colo. Spgs. power company's generators :o).   I was under the 
 impression that the longitudinal "ground" waves were to be achieved by 
 operating down around 20kHz or less. I am also under the impression that 
 Tesla was attempting to excite a natural earth resonance(Schumman resonance 
 as they are now called) of about 7.8 Hz or perhaps a harmonic of such.  All 
 of this was a result of his observation of lightning (see his paper "The 
 Problem of Increasing Human Energy").   
Tesla was not attempting to excite the Schumman resonance as this is an 
earth/ionosphere effect not a ground effect.  The whole point of my theory is 
that he was using charge waves, which are not subject to the inverse square 
propogation law.      

 >  
 >  One has to remember that the output "load" of a Tesla coil is basically 
the
 >  local capacitance of the surrounding objects with loss.  This represents a
 >  very "local" effect.  There is little that allows energy to travel outside
 >  this local area of a Tesla coil even if it is a "big one" like Tesla used.
 >  Tesla made one great "Tesla coil number uno".  However, the world power
 >  transmission thing seems to have fallen to pieces.  Sounded good but it 
has
 >  never been demonstrated, proven, worked, etc...  
 
 If I understand what I have read about all this, Tesla's longitudinal waves 
 would travel along the surface like the waves in a pond after a rock was 
 tossed into it and that with the proper frequency, the waves would 
 constructively interfere with each other after reaching the opposite point 
of 
 the earth.  Note that he never claimed to actually transmit current (which 
 would be incredibly lossy as Terry points out), but rather, he was intending 
 to create nodal points that one could then "pick off energy" by placing two 
 strategically place ground rods that would always be at different 
potentials. 
  With the properly tuned receiver, one could utilize telluric currents and 
it 
 would place no load on his generator.  Incidentally, I also think that what 
 he said about getting usable amounts of energy could have been merely a 
 matter of perspective.  In his days, there were no televisions or washing 
 machines or refrigerators(ok you get the idea).  A usable amount of power 
 might have simply been enough for a couple of lightbulbs and a radio 
 receiver.  A person in the middle of nowhere might appreciate that amount of 
 freely available power.  
     One other note about this is that in order to achieve this,  Tesla 
 actually avoided the streamer discharge that we all try to maximize these 
 days.  That is why his Wardenclyffe tower was designed with such a large 
 topload(I forget at the moment, but wasn't it about sixty something feet in 
 diameter?).
68
  Another point is that his tower was over two hundred feet tall.  
 There would be no "local" objects to load down his tertiary coil, would 
 there?  With such a large radius of curvature, tremendous voltages could be 
 achieved without the spark discharge and then the Q of the secondary would 
be 
 very large.  In this mode of operation, I believe the quarter wave theory is 
 valid rather than the lumped element notion that is valid with streamer 
 discharge.  These are two entirely different modes of operation.  
I agree on your point that the ¼ lamda operation does not apply under 
streamer loaded conditions.  The effects that this lack of streamer load had 
on the behaviour of the resonant system are also obvious.
 >  
 >  Sorry, but after 80+ years of playing with it, the results are still 
 zero...
 > 
 I seem to remember reading about a system that operated in Canada during 
 Tesla's lifetime, although is was not as large as the Wardenclyffe tower.  I 
 also just recently read about some so called Scalar weapons and a "Tesla 
 Shield" developed by the Russians that are reported to work from Tesla's 
 principals.  These were said to have been witnessed by pilots in Afganistan 
 who saw the effects from several miles away, so who knows how accurate this 
 is.  I just mention it to stir up a little controversy :o)
I to have read of these huge russian tesla coils - although some of the stuff 
eg. mind control, which they are creditted with seems a little far fetched.
 
 >  It is easy to "write and say" things like "1 Giga Joule" of energy (even 
in
 >  Tesla's day).  However, "Me thinks" I would notice it, if it was really
 >  true ;-)))  Even a Giga Joule is not that much power by today's standards
 >  of power generation.  Lasers and other "single shot" systems can easily
 >  reach that "standard".  However, no known Tesla coil system comes within
 >  0.5% of it....
 >  
 It is also easy to dismiss Tesla's theories if you are trying to think about 
 them in regards to conventional EM theories, but unless someone actually 
 duplicates his work EXACTLY,  how can it be proved that he was incorrect?   
 Perhaps it is due to my lack of electronic training(I learned most of what I 
 know on my own) that allows me to think that there could be more than meets 
 the eye in this area.  I have read and reread as much of the available 
 material about Tesla in hopes of catching on to what he was really thinking, 
 which is difficult to do this since one has to filter through other's 
 opinions and ideas as to what Tesla himself was thinking.  All I can really 
 say is that he insisted that his longitudinal waves were not like the 
 ordinary Hertzian waves and yet we still today try to equate the two.  
My point is that they were not an EM phenomenon. 
 >  Cheers,
 >  
 >   Terry
 >  
 I won't give up my opinion on this at this point  :o)   I still think Tesla 
 had something there that nobody today quite understands as he did.  I will 
 not change my mind until someone builds a coil system EXACTLY like Tesla's( 
 with a fifty foot plus diameter primary/secondary and the correspondingly 
 large tertiary coil and topload etc.), then pumps a few megawatts  into the 
 system, and THEN shows that he was wrong.
 Mike >>
I don't think that will be necessary - or possible.

Regards
Nick Field