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Re: Capacitor charge, were is it?

Tesla List wrote:
> 
> >From lod-at-pacbell-dot-netWed Oct 30 21:30:30 1996
> Date: Sun, 29 Oct 1995 23:18:12 +0000
> From: GE Leyh <lod-at-pacbell-dot-net>
> To: tesla-at-pupman-dot-com
> Subject: Re: Capacitor charge, were is it?
> 
> Richard Hull wrote:
> 
> <snip>
> 
> > The idea that there are actually a quantity of electrons stuffed on a
> > metal plate is pretty stupid and somewhat niave.
> 
> How would you then explain the operation of a classic electrometer, where
> two gold leaves suspended in a vacuum repel each other, when a charge is
> deposited upon them?
> I think that the main point of contention in this argument is simply the
> definition of the word 'charge'.  For the sake of discussion, I would like
> to suggest the classical definition, where charge is measured in coulombs
> and the charge on a electron is 1.6 e-19 coulombs.
> Energy (or work) is measured in Joules, which has units of volts X coulombs.
> 
> > Have you ever brought
> > the back of your arm up to a slab of metal WITH NO POWER SOURCE
> > ATTACHED and felt the hairs stand on end? ( I THINK NOT!)  What about a
> > piece of teflon or styrofoam?  (ALL THE TIME)
> > Where is the REAL charge retained?  (the dielectric).
> 
> Actually, a dielectric need not possess a net charge in order to store
> electrical energy.  Energy (not charge) is stored in a dielectric by
> distorting the orbits of electrons around atoms (like cocking a spring),
> thereby producing an electric field. It is the electric field that moves
> charge around on nearby conductors (or arms).  If the number of electrons
> and protons in the dielectric are equal then it has no net charge, regardless
> of how much stored electrical energy it might contain.
> 
> -GL


Gerg,

I have no beef with metallic items conducting charge and or energy from 
place to place.  That is really all that conductors do!  The charge 
however never resides on them.  It can be pulled through them to manifest 
dynamic effects and spearate new charge in dielectrics at the opposite 
ends.  I believe I explained the electroscope and electrometer bit to 
another party on this list the other day.

Richard Hull, TCBOR